Anna and Flori take you through everything you need to know when it comes to creating and executing a successful free challenge in your business.
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Tune in to hear about:
- The crucial first steps of setting up your challenge
- How pain and pleasure points are essential to attracting the right leads
- Why it's important to layer your touchpoints across multiple channels throughout the entire challenge
- Why you need to be prepared to pivot
- Important must-do's when wrapping up a challenge
Anna Jonak: [00:00:42] Welcome to Episode 40 of the Brave Business Podcast. It's Anna and Flori and we're back together. It has been a little while since the two of us were together right because we have been doing some amazing interviews even if I do say so myself with some fabulous people and actually have to ask, any faves, Flori? Anyone out there you'd be like Oh my God mind blown.
Flori Pyke: [00:01:02] I have to say like I've enjoyed speaking with everyone, but I feel like for our listeners, there were a lot of value bombs around the interview I did with Helen and Jacqui from Two Girls and a Laptop which were specifically around e-mail marketing like it was a very specific kind of niche episode which just uncovered so many gold mines. So that was probably one of my faves. What about you?
Anna Jonak: [00:01:25] Oh I just totally enjoyed hanging out with Kate Toon the other day. Just having a really good chat about like success and life and the highs and lows and the rides that was or there areand you know where to from here. It was just really nice to have a candid conversation with someone kind of like, because you know she's got a program like we have a program and I guess having kind of like you know, it was kind of more personal for me [both laugh] than it was for everybody else. But personally I quite enjoyed that. So yeah that was fun. But yeah it's been awesome getting to chat to all these awesome people. But I have to say I have missed you and I coming together and so it's pretty cool to get together for this episode. And it's a bit of a juicy one that we've got planned because we're going to take our listeners today, you lovely ladies, through one of our sales funnels from start to finish with our most recent Goal Setting Challenge and I'd say if anyone out there who's been thinking about running a challenge of this nature, we know a few of our students have kind of dabbled in it or thinking about it or if you want a real deep dive into the ins and outs of really of a sales funnel anyway with all the moving parts you'll see with an activation like this, I think that this episode is really going to blow your mind because we're going to really deep dive into so many different areas.
Flori Pyke: [00:02:36] Yes there's a lot to cover. [both laugh] It's very value-packed. Now in true Brave Business Podcast form though, I feel like we haven't talked about this in ages but our signature hashtag winning and hashtag losing moment, so I'll share mine first. So basically this is a huge win as I was saying to you Anna before we got on the call. I've recently got a nanny and oh my God it's so lovely. [both laugh] Honestly, I just felt like I was just finding pockets of time, but really finding pockets of time left, right, center, whereas now it's like I have this dedicated time to work on the business. And granted it's not a lot of hours because school hours but it's just so great. It's really enabled me to kind of find my stride with baby Julian so that's been great and the balance of work, the juggle I should say. So that's been great. And then also, I guess more on a mutual front from a winning standpoint, we have some pretty exciting stuff in the works, don't we?
Anna Jonak: [00:03:34] Oh we do. It's kind of hashtag winning and losing. [Flori laughs] It's like going through the process of the realisations and the decisions that need to be made is kind of losing because they're so laborious and they're big. But the flip side of that is exciting. So you know what it's like, we talk about mindset the good and the bad. You kind of have to go through the lessons and the learnings but the outcomes and the next steps are going to be very exciting. So yes definitely on that front. Yes well, I'm very excited that you've got a nanny now and having you on set hours as opposed to like flying by the seat of your pants, lady. [laughs] You've done a good job juggling school holidays and a new baby over the last little while. And I can't even believe I've got school holidays to contend with but fortunately my husband has actually taken off that whole period so I'm like winning. [Flori says Oh wow that's amazing] That is one of my winnings. But I think that on my winning note that's when I'm probably moving house so it'll probably be a week of like he can just help us move into a new place. So yes, my winning is very much looking forward to moving into someone new in the hood and levelling up a little bit rather than the house that has... I mean I'm very fond of this house because it has it kind of gave us our first foothold really back in Sydney after moving back from W.A. but there are a few things falling apart in and around it.
Flori Pyke: [00:04:55] As I've said many times, I like your house. I think it's great. But I appreciate it. I get it. I totally get it.
Anna Jonak: [00:05:02] The guy actually is literally pulling everything down. He's literally redoing kitchens and the bathrooms and everything. [Flori says when you guys move out. It's crazy.] Yeah, he realises it's time. So yeah. But obviously we weren't going to sit through that. But that's winning and losing. Oh my God school hours. And not just school hours but for me personally, I've got to say that with jealousy I have to say as well, because oh my God, Facebook is horrible for this but my start to school has not been fun and frivolous and all these beautiful pictures of like kids happy, smiling with their families, skipping down the street to school. Mine was more of a screaming child hanging off my leg that I had to throw into a classroom. So I must admit that this last month has not been an easy transition emotionally for anyone in our family. But we are coming at the other side so we're moving into the winning territory slowly, slowly.
Flori Pyke: [00:05:55] Oh that's great. I mean I will agree with you on school hours front. For days, I feel like I'm in like power mode from 9:30 to 2:30. If that actually, more like 2:15. So yeah, I definitely hear you on the school hour loss, front. And also, I think it's important to acknowledge on on a mutual front with the losing bit of a challenging start to 2019. I think you know we have been presented in the business with a lot of key lessons that to some degree I think we definitely saw coming. We probably didn't have as many plan Bs in the back pocket as we would have liked but we did manage to surmount the challenges and did have a great start to the year even though there were a lot, a lot of bumps in the road. [Anna agrees] But you know as we talk about it all the time with every challenge, you can either let it defeat you or find the lesson in it and act from that lesson and I think that's one of the things which is why Anna was talking about you know this mutual hashtag winning, exciting changes are afoot and these are changes that are really fueled by the fact that we've had a lot of bumps in the road in starting 2019. So watch the space because we're going to be turning the hashtag losing into hashtag winning in no time.
Anna Jonak: [00:07:14] That is true, and can I just say on a mindset front that normally because this is what's happened to us, as you normally you get presented with the same lessons again and again. So whether it's in business or in life, you'll see the same themes coming up and sometimes you know you're not quite ready to address them but when you see them for the third time, and it's a bit like [Flori laughs] hello you got to take some action. So look out for your lessons because the bottom line really is they probably won't go away. They will keep going back until you do something about them. So which we will be doing and yes hashtag watch this space.
Flori Pyke: [00:07:45] Yeah totally. OK. Now all this aside, we have a lot of content to get you through today. So let's kick off with the Goal Setting Challenge and talk you through exactly what we did so that you can take some key lessons from it in executing your challenge. Now if you did miss our Goal Setting Challenge, bit of a shame because it was truly truly epic. It was a massive activation that we ran in January to really kick the year off and we had over fifteen hundred business women join us. And yeah despite the bumps in the road it really truly was an electric, inspirational and incredible journey that we got to share with over fifteen hundred women in that challenge. So what we'd like to do is basically take you through that challenge now and how we develop a challenge. So regardless of just the Goal Setting Challenge, this is just any challenge and the steps and the phases that we that we go through. So there's basically three phases that we consider when we develop an activation or a funnel like this. And that's what we're going to take you through today. Now there's a lot of moving parts. [Anna agrees] And it is a massive undertaking you know to give you some context when Anna and I set out to map out a challenge. We do it weeks and weeks and weeks in advance. I feel like now we have we've gotten quite good at it. Yeah, a month. [Anna says I'd say a month, about a month we're talking about something new and it's about I'm a month or away.] But in saying that I was going to say you know, when we first did our very first challenge it was probably like two months because we didn't really know what we were doing. And when you don't know what you're doing it takes time, right? So even though now we know what we're doing, you know we spend a good month and it's literally heads down bum upfor that month preparing for the challenge let alone the execution of the challenge. So let's talk about the phases now and those three phases I'll let you kick off with the first one, but they're divided into the following just to give you some context of the first one is really what needs to happen in the lead up to the challenge. The second is what needs to happen during the challenge. And the third is what needs to happen post challenge.
Anna Jonak: [00:09:49] Yeah. So let's start with the lead up because this is obviously crucial. And I guess the first point and the most important point is really thinking about the purpose of the challenge. What it is that you want to create? The content you want to create, the message or experience you want to deliver. Because ultimately you really need something incredibly compelling to deliver through your challenge which is going to educate and inspire and give your audience value. They must feel like this is a really value laden experience but simultaneously, you really want to be delivering them a very real taste of what it is that you do and what it is that you want to sell. And I think it's really important to hone in on that because a lot of people and we've seen people dabble in challenges, they're not very good at really put in their brand and their offer. You know right in the middle of what they're doing it kind of becomes an afterthought as opposed to right off the bat being very clear that this is here, and this is what you do. And this is a taste of it and you're going to get to come on a journey with me right now. Look when developing your content you may need to think about the pain points of your avatar. So we've talked about customer research before. You need to understand how they’re feeling and what they want because you need to create something that is going to be like when they see it on an ad or on a social post, they're like oh my God I need that in my life. And then it's really thinking about taking them actually on a real journey. OK. So not just putting together random pieces of content but really thinking about the journey and how they build on each other. And then sowing seeds of what you can do and how you can help them in within that essentially.
Flori Pyke: [00:11:09] Yeah, it's almost a bit of an art, isn't it? [Anna agrees] I feel like now we have this down pat but when we first started off with our challenges, it was how much do we give away of what we do and how we can help them. Now we're very comfortable in the approach that we adopt in saying you know we have the solution for you in this program, but it is an art in sowing the seed and when to start letting them know this is how we can help you through the program ultimately. But it is. It does take time and the thing is I think it's really important what you said Anna and I do want to recap on this is that it really is a journey you need to be very conscious of the steps that you take them through and how they build on each other so that your prospect who is experiencing this can very consciously see and understand how this works and ultimately be led to your offering as the solution and that's where in the journey is so important.
Anna Jonak: [00:12:03] Definitely. I was gonna say one thing as well to mention is that I think that you want to ensure that you are also getting your prospects to actually achieve or like make little wins constantly so that they can see results from what you're teaching them like you're not obviously giving them the everything that you do. I mean it wouldn't be impossible for a few days. I mean especially in our situation but ultimately give them enough insight and information that they can make leaps and changes so that they're kind of having those kind of mini wins as you progress essentially.
Flori Pyke: [00:12:33] Definitely. It goes back to that whole theory of Pavlov.You get a win and they start to associate that win with you and they start to understand wow these people can really help me right. And so where you can sprinkle some of those wins throughout your challenge, it will be then so much easier for you to sell your offering because they'll associate your offering with winning basically with being able to achieve results and success. So I think that's such a great point to make. And I think as well it speaks to the fact that they feel confident then in the results that you can deliver and they can then trust you to deliver more throughout your offering. So totally agree. OK. Now with content delivery, look, the format that you use to deliver the actual journey, the content of the challenge is completely up to you. You know you might use a variety of different things. We certainly do. So we'll do everything from Facebook lives to actually being in a Facebook community constantly interacting with our prospects, the videos in the past we've pre-recorded them. We might do them live like I just said, also we've done webinars that are live, workbooks, checklists that you can really mix things up and this is up to you. But I think one thing to be conscious of here is that you do want to add various layers across different touch points because some of your audience might react better or be more familiar with the Facebook live versus a webinar or someone may not have the time for a webinar but may want to just refer to a checklist and then be like wow this is really good and maybe I will tune into the next webinar. So you do need to be conscious of mixing it up a little bit to appeal to the different learners that you have in that community. Few kind of key points here with the content, obviously you know it needs to be very on brand. We talk about the importance of brand guidelines a lot on this podcast and that's something you definitely want to have. If you don't yet in place you know, invest in your brand guidelines and ensure that that your challenge from front to back is very on brand. Proofread things, very obvious. But I mean it's a no brainer and script the journey, script the flow. If you're going to do videos, make sure that you have scripts behind those videos. Don't just freestyle it because there's going to be very important messages that you want to deliver throughout those videos. And also like we just said you're going to want to sprinkle some allusions to the fact that you can help these people at the end of the challenge with your offering and you need to be very strategic in when you sprinkle that messaging. So I think scripting is absolutely essential. One final point here is to really deliver calls to action and make it very clear on the next steps that you want people to take at every turn. So at the end of a video for instance, Anna and I will always say OK this is your next step. Like go complete the workbook and let us know in the Facebook group you know what challenges are coming up for you so that we can work with you live there. And then from there, we take it to the next step and so on so we're very clear in what we expect of them at every turn so that they can get those results.
Anna Jonak: [00:15:39] I think you need to guide people. [Flori agrees] I think you need to almost imagine that people like are dumb and I mean that in the nicest way. But you need to literally step everything out for everybody from start to finish to you know, here's the e-mail you're gonna get at this time to this is what, this is when you need to open it. And once you've opened it, you need to watch this and then you need to click this and then you need to do that and so on and so forth because it's actually incredibly surprising how people can get lost even if you feel like you've simplified as much as possible to the point where we've taken screenshots of things and put them in Facebook group has been like this is where you can find your workbook. This is where you can do X Y Z with the video because you know what I think people consume on different formats and we always check video and we always check that you know iPad, desktop and so on and so forth across different Mac and PC but there's still just going to be someone with a really old browser or something going on and they're just not going to have to access it or you know someone's using a messenger bot strategy and they're in the Facebook group and they're seeing what everyone else is seeing on a different strategy. So I think that it's very important to kind of step things out as well. And then I think also important with content delivery is how you drip feed it. So obviously for us we normally do anything from a three to four-day challenge. But we have tried running a four-day challenge over eight days where we did something every two days we release something. Other times we've just done it back to back. And I think for us, the fast and furious we kind of and we really enjoy getting through and driving momentum with people. But you know some people might not get through the material as quickly, so every two days works better for others. So you need to test things like this and definitely running a challenge you're going to have to test all sorts of things that you have to the frequency that you release material to the time of day that you're releasing it, whether you're releasing it purely by email or whether you're posting it in the Facebook group as well. And this is just some things to consider when it comes to your output and how you're giving people links to content and whether they're embedded and so on and so forth.
Flori Pyke: [00:17:35] Yes definitely. Alongside this content that we're speaking of I think it's also really important in the lead up to get crystal clear on the specifics of what you are going to sell to them at the end of the journey. And whilst it seems glaringly obvious, there's a lot of considerations here. Because if your cart is going to be open say for a week or even five days, you might want to sprinkle some bonuses over the course of those five days or seven days and you're going to want to get clear on what those bonuses look like, how you're going to articulate them, what they're called, what they contain. You need to prep all that on any guarantees that you have testimonials, what have you. OK. So and then let alone you know actually mapping out and building the corresponding sales offer pages and the sales e-mails which will come on to in a bit more detail shortly but lots to consider there even just when it comes to your offer.
Anna Jonak: [00:18:26] It makes sense as well I think to consider it in the way that we've step people through is to consider in line with the content because you're really taking them on the journey to a sell. You're taking them on a journey where you're giving them lots of information and experiences which ultimately lead them to a point where they can get to make a decision. So it seems natural to build all my sell into content because it is a piece of content really as well, isn't it? [Flori agrees] OK. And then from there obviously, once you've got your kind of whole flow down of what you're going to deliver, how are you going to deliver it, what are you going to offer people and so on and so forth. It really comes down to that all-important bit of actually getting that hungry audience, getting all the people to so that you've got the eyes and ears on what it is you want to take them through. So your next job is definitely to basically create this mass audience that we said we had 15 hundred people on our audience. Obviously, everybody is going to have different investments that we are going to have to put in. But that said it depends on your niche. What was it one of our students got the most ridiculous cost per leadfor one of her challenges in the dog training space, right? [Flori says Oh my God] It was amazing. I mean what, for like a few hundred bucks, she kind of like the same number of people to our like thousands and thousands of dollars.
Flori Pyke: [00:19:35] But it just goes to show you that she is not competing in a highly like there's not a lot of competitors in her niche and that she has a great standout.
Anna Jonak: [00:19:44] Totally. Well that's it. That just goes to show challenges work and it doesn't matter whether you're in the core space or the program space for business you know. This is dog training and it works. So it really just depends on what is your putting in front of people. So few things to get going when you obviously want to recruit people and getting in front of that audience. First off is the opt in page which I think you can talk about.
Flori Pyke: [00:20:09] Yeah. So basically with the opt in page this is essentially the lander. So the page that you're directing your prospects to, to collect you know their name and email address and I think that it's really important as Anna said at one point in terms of mapping this out, you need to really understand your avatar's pain points and understanding their pain points and what keeps them up at night as well as their pleasure points, that kind of language is really essential for creating a cracking lander and squeeze page that is going to convert for you. Once you've got the lander set up, you also need to consider the thank you page and what messaging you want to put on that thank you page. So whether that is you know to go check your spam and promo folders for the confirmation email or to go you know connect with us on Insta, what have you. This is valuable real estate. Think very wisely about the messaging that you put on your thank you page because it's already creating that innate behavior in your prospects of taking a micro commitment and the next action and that's how you really want to make it clear like this is the next action at every turn. So thank you page, OK, what is that next action right away you're giving that to them. OK. You also want to ensure it's all mobile responsive such a no brainer, but I can't tell you how many people don't tick this box. It's really important and as Anna said like check it across different mobiles so different devices so not just you know your iPhone but also like the Samsung and I don't even know what people use when it's not an iPhone. [Anna says you're like if it's not an iPhone what are they? What can you do?] I don't know. Samsung, I think it's called. [both laugh]
Anna Jonak: [00:21:49] I've got to say you know what it takes forever though. But it's so important. It's one thing that we do is rigorous testing, right? As soon as everything's ready to go on all fronts, from how you deliver the content and the content platform it's delivered on to your opt in, thank you page and so and so forth, everything is tested, proofread, tested and by multiple people because you obviously want to put your very best foot forward and make sure that the experience is really user friendly.
Flori Pyke: [00:22:13] Yes definitely. Well because exactly, if it's not user friendly and if your lander is not optimized on mobile, you're going to lose a lot of conversion. So for instance to your point Anna, if that opt in box that collects their name and email, they have to scroll down the page to put their name and email address in that opt in box be it on desktop or mobile you're going to lose a lot of conversions. That's got to be front and center. So I totally agree. Now one key point I just want to talk to you guys about really quickly before we move on to the next thing with respect to your landers is to think about getting a variety of links for your landers. So if you're driving paid traffic to different platforms via Facebook, Google and then you have like Instagram or organic, think about creating custom hyperlinks sorry for all those different platforms so that you can then at the end of the day when you complete the challenge be very clear on what people came through, what platform because you can then tag them accordingly in the email marketing platform. I know that sounds complex but once you kind of start going down the barrel of a challenge, it will make more sense and I think this goes back to talking about the importance of e-mail marketing, segmentation and tagging. It will enable you to then track what's working best across what platform.
Anna Jonak: [00:23:30] Yes. But ultimately your ROI. You're seeing that if all the leads came through your email list because you sent out the generic one versus one that's on Facebook. You can see how much you know what like you said what's working. So everything has double URL don't they just to make it complicated but it's not really that complicated. [laughs] It just sounds it from the outside.
Flori Pyke: [00:23:50] That's right. One thing sorry before we just quickly talk about the next step here, I just want to say because I get this question a lot is what's a good conversion rate for a lander? A really good conversion rate is about 50 percent. OK. That's like cracking. So if you're if you're hitting that mark, that's awesome.
Anna Jonak: [00:24:08] Awesome. OK. So obviously once you've got this super sexy opt in page which speaks to your audience and they read the copy and they go wow sign me up. They hit that button and they're in. Then you're on your way. But we have to drive people to the opt in page, right? So your opt in page is ready to go, how are we going to drive people and one of the things that we do, is well one of the things we personally do is paid traffic is Facebook ads. Obviously, you can try Google ads. You can do YouTube ads, all sorts of different things that you can do. We have specifically found that Facebook and Insta has been pretty good for our audience. So it's something that we do I'm going to let you talk about this because it's tied to your jam and there's no point in even trying to like wing it.
Flori Pyke: [00:24:45] Oh OK. Although I feel like you're getting your head around this stuff. I think you underestimate yourself. It's what I like to tell myself with the whole mindset thing. [both laugh] No look just at minimum you want to test your ads. OK. So think about creating at minimum two versions of copy, one you know short, one longer, two versions of creative so that you can basically test what works best before you put a pile of money behind it. Put your best foot forward to do some testing so that you can understand OK this is going to be the best performing ad, copy and creative. I'm going to let Facebook put its money behind that. That's essentially, I think the key messaging there that I want you guys to be conscious of when it comes to the ads and obviously you know ad building is a more complex subject and something, we certainly teach in a lot of detail can help you through in the program. But just key takeaway here when you are doing a challenge, make sure you do some A/B split testing.
Anna Jonak: [00:25:52] So I remember doing, this is back in the day when I started my coaching business, I remember this is because of the coaching side of things that people are either drawn to pleasure or drawn to pain. So quite often you try different... I remember using pictures of this woman like loving life versus a woman really miserable to see which one resonated and actually to be fair, I don't remember there being a massive winner, but I found that the miserable lady just kind of got more comments. Do you know what I mean? It was just maybe more striking or something with the kind of you're not used to seeing it or something.
Flori Pyke: [00:26:21] So it's a really interesting point that you draw on and you're so right. But actually there's been a lot of statistical studies done around whether pain or pleasure resonates more with the human mind and apparently pain because it's frightening. We respond and react to far more than pleasure. It's kind of like the news you know. It's all bad ninety nine percent of the time. It's like a car crash you can't stop looking at it. And pain is very similar. So it's actually been statistically proven that pain, we respond more to you like we will, it will make us take action more than pleasure.
Anna Jonak: [00:26:59] Yes. Well same in mindset stuff. Sometimes you have to drive that much pain to make someone take action because a pleasure is like Oh that's nice. But if we make you feel really bad. Okay okay yeah. Okay. Okay I'll go and do it. Oh actually this is quite pleasurable. It is that kind of thing. Anyway. So paid traffic. Yes. Obviously, you need to learn what mediums work for you when you're going to invest if you have money to invest. But you know all is not lost if you don't have money to invest but we've certainly found that putting a good budget has really helped for us. And that budget has definitely like started very small to begin with and we tested it and we tried things and over time and yup Flori and I had many conversations with me like what how much do you want to spend? No! But it's always worked out. And in fact it definitely is one of those things where now we'll actually just throw more money at it. So we just give it a whirl. And because you have to start you know once you've got that testing and experience behind you, I think you do start to just trust in the process. OK. So from paid traffic, the other kind of channels you have, your own channels so you don't just want to be using pay traffic to recruit for you opt in and to get your sign ups. But think about the email list that you might already have. So we always kind of like reach out to our email lists and send them a couple of invites across the period and maybe like send them the first video in some instances to get them excited and geed up about joining us and also change the call to actions on our home page of our website for any traffic coming through and lots with social media posts on Facebook, Insta, LinkedIn. So we definitely use and take over the whole of our own platforms to drive as well for any eyeballs that we've already got and leads we already have. And then on to the earned traffic. You talk a bit about that.
Flori Pyke: [00:28:38] Yeah. Awesome. So. Exactly. With earned, it's basically leveraging you know any existing relationships or partnerships that you have. So you know you might think of approaching some of your partners or people in the same space and doing a guest blog post for them or you know sending some e-mails out to feature on different podcasts where your audience is you know that they listen to that podcast. So one key tip I have for you is that if you are going to approach create a joint venture partnership, you want to be really clear on the terms that you set with that joint venture relationship. So create a contract even and make sure that everyone's clear on the terms, the commissions, so that everyone is onboard. They agree. Everyone's game. OK. And also one thing that's very important is that you want to make it very easy for your partners to help you promote your challenge. And so the easiest thing that you can do for them I think the best thing sorry that you can do for them to make it as easy as possible for them is to create essentially like a little promo pack. So you know whenever we go to our partners and we get them on board, we send them a little contract they sign and then we send them a promo pack. And what that promo pack contains is their custom URL. It's a URL unique to them so that we can tag and understand any leads that they bring across the line and therefore if any conversions, if we get a new student, if it's from them or not. And in this promo pack in addition to that custom URL we’ll include you know social tiles, we’ll include a variety of different tiles, email copy, anything to make it as easy as possible for them to share and promote to their audience basically.
Anna Jonak: [00:30:19] Definitely. Yeah. We've definitely reached out and made some great relationships over time and also the beauty then is that you know it can become reciprocal where you're kind of working to promote each other's things which is really nice especially when they're complementary and you kind of have a really good trust built with I guess other providers out there. So yes. So you've got three different options there: using paid traffic, your own channels and channels so any relationships you can build. They don't even have to be like joint ventures in terms of you know the level of commissions and affiliates. In that respect you can also just be doing shout outs for people. Shout out for shout out and so on and so forth. And ideally where you can if you can tap into someone else's email list though, that's where the gold is at. It's being able to reach people in that medium and you obviously talking by email not being dead the other day. But it's always as soon as the emails go out that's when the sign ups always rocket every time. [Flori says isn't that true?] Yeah. Whether it's sent out by us or a partner or whatever it is the emails always drive the greatest action. OK so you got a point now as we're taking you through things where you've obviously started to drive sign ups and you've got a group of people coming through who are ready and excited. What is your next step? Our next step you want to give them a space to congregate so that essentially, they can get excited and start connecting and the conversation can start happening whilst they wait for you to activate. So this is where we've always used creating a Facebook group essentially so that our audience pretty much on that thank you page once they've gone through the sign up are directed to come and join the community and then we give them all sorts of different touch points in there to bring questions, to start communicating amongst each other so we can start the conversation. Some things to think about when you set up a challenge Facebook group are definitely making sure that you have like your rules and regulations in there so that people know not to like you know start posting things or trying to recruit in there. We've definitely had some interesting people come through in Facebook groups and definitely try and recruit and PM people which you obviously don't... We don't want to have happen. You want to create a safe nurturing space, not have business owners come in and try and sell to you or your community so something else we do is we always have a pinned post with all you need to know information about the challenge and any video links because we always do a housekeeping video a couple of days before or the day before we launch so that people know exactly what to expect. That's definitely talking about stepping everything out again for everybody. We also do a Facebook introduction post where people can jump on and introduce themselves in their business and it's a really good opportunity for us to learn more about people because we can actually then go in and have a little bit of a stalk about people and their businesses and what they're doing and so on so forth and that I mean we've always talked about this but personalisation is so important so if we can actually learn as much as possible when we can show that to people then we're able to demonstrate a bit about us really in the process where we kind of like engaging with them on another level. So for us Facebook as a group is a really great opportunity to add another layer and touchpoint to our experience and build relationships and really get to know our audience outside of just delivering them content. We really want an experience with our audience because that's how we run in our program. It's very experiential. It's very personalised.
Flori Pyke: [00:33:20] Yeah love it. Another just kind of little tip there when you are creating the Facebook group and you're welcoming people to the Facebook group. Definitely take the time to tag them in a post. It basically will drive the Facebook algorithm and what that means is that more people will see members of the group that the group is active and there'll be that much more inclined to then you know go check in have a look at what's going on, what have you. So it is well worth the time tagging people to welcome them into the community. We then move into phase two which is what happens during the challenge. So once you have all the moving parts in place for the lead up to the challenge and you've got all those people in the group and you're ready to go what's the next step. OK. So this is really the experience and the challenge that you deliver over the course of however many days you want to make it as Anna said it might be three days, four days. We've even done five days actually I think in the past, but you essentially want to think about drip feeding content material over each day of the challenge. OK. And you might space out the days like Anna said or have them all back to back. How do you drip feed that content material. We do it by email in case of very simply and then we also use the Facebook group to announce the release of that content and to open the floor for any questions for dialogue because often then what we'll do is we'll hop into the group that night and do a Facebook live answering any questions that our audience has had and that's been a great avenue to really display our expertise and to show that you know what we really know what we're talking about. We want to add extra layers of information and experience to this challenge for you. And that's been a great segue for us to do it. I think as well as Anna said when she talks about the Facebook group it's really important to emphasise that group is awesome because it really does enable you to engage with every single person to answer questions be super present and that's something that we're very big on. So whenever it's challenge week for us, we basically close the calendars down to anything but challenge and we are in that group. Everyone is typing, commenting, answering questions. We're there to showcase our expertise. It's our chance to basically show people and prospects that we know what we're talking about. We really want to help you. How can we do this you know and what it's like to work with us. I think that's one of the most important things. So yes very important to drive as much engagement as possible in that Facebook group so you can learn the pain points and showcase you know you can help these people.
Anna Jonak: [00:35:51] Yeah I think I really like the fact that we have like the pre-recorded video which obviously is designed to deliver a certain or specific content and take people on a specific journey but then we have the kind of the freestyle Q and As or Facebook lives where it's very much about interaction and engagement. So you're able to kind of bring a bit more of you that you know that you that isn't kind of delivering information but you as a person into the group. So I think the balance is quite important and you need to find what works for you. I mean we started out our challenge is doing everything as little mini videos or Facebook live. And they also worked. So it really depends on your audience. Some people might not want fancy video. Some people might be happy with the Facebook live. Equally some people don't come to the Facebook group like there's a big portion of people that we probably what 60 percent come to the Facebook group and there's a good 40 percent that don't. And interestingly enough there's always a good portion of people that sign up that we've never heard of through the Facebook group or interacted with because they've obviously just gone through the process of actually going through the flow in the content and the community was less important at that point. So yeah I think this just goes to show that multiple touch points and layers of experience can be very important because different people engage differently. [Flori agrees] OK. So from delivering your challenge and kind of showcasing your expertise and being there in different formats and being able to engage with your audience obviously you move from the challenge delivery and the content and having those many wins to a point when ultimately you need to sell. I'm just going to say that. You do. [Flori laughs] A lot of people feel a bit icky about selling. But ultimately, you know if you have a program or something. This is the whole point people. So at this point you know you need to be bought in to how exciting this whole thing is because you're opening the doors to something. It's going to be a limited time. You've got to create scarcity and urgency around it, excitement like it's exciting. This is an opportunity for people to come and experience the next level the next thing have that next level of transformation and experience and it's so important to make sure you do that justice with the delivery of doors open. We often do Facebook lives, there’s a whole email sequence, landing pages to go through, there’s Facebook tiles. We do Facebook video testimonials from students either on our page or in the Facebook group we’ll reach out to people specifically who we've seen in the community that we think are very relevant and a really good fit for what we do so we tag people in post. We're not shy. We're here to say hey we’ll tap you on the shoulder like we love what you do, we think you've really got something. Let's help you take it to that next level. Again I think that speaks to our personalisation and really wanting to give people more and you know our students always come to our challenges it's so funny like they're always like the more that they can get there in doing basically. It's just great because then they can come in and share their experiences and it's all very real and authentic and it doesn't really come from us right. It comes from them. [Flori agrees] And nothing speaks better than coming from that perspective.
Flori Pyke: [00:38:47] Yes definitely. And I think one thing that's really important here to emphasise is to be on your toes so that only speaks to the fact that you need to be prepared that things might not go according to plan. So for Anna and I that is totally what happened in January. We'll be totally candid. Things did not go to plan and we kind of s**t our pants a bit. But you know what. We pulled up our pants and we put our runners on and off we went creating a plan that we knew would work or testing something at least. And we did. We tested things and it worked and everything came full circle and we were fine. But my point here is that you need to be reactive and you need to be very prepared to respond to what's happening. OK so you might have to change things up. OK.
Anna Jonak: [00:39:36] I don't think we've ever not changed something. [Flori agrees] I think we've always gone in with like for example the sales sequence which maybe you can talk a bit more about but we do always prepare a sales sequence which takes people through a series of steps and obviously as the countdown goes towards doors closing but I don't think that we have ever not been reactive because you have to see kind of like the volume of people interested or signing up or the conversation happening dependent on your strategy and then you always have to kind of make decisions in those moments.
Flori Pyke: [00:40:03] Absolutely. You need to be responsive. And I think that again goes to highlight how important it is to have this Facebook group because you can see the dialogue that's happening. You can see you know objections that are coming up for people and it provides you with a great platform to then say OK look this is kind of what's happening I can see the conversation that's happening you know this is how we need to respond. And definitely. So what we do further to Anna's point around the sales sequence is we always write an email sequence and have a bit of a plan in place around the open cart period. But that usually changes. It is nice to have a plan though I find. It kind of gives you something to draw on and you might mix it up and take elements from one day and put it in a different day. But it is important to some degree to have a plan but also to be prepared to pivot and change the plan. And on that note as you change the plan you want to be prepared to add new touch points. So depending on how things are going in that open cart period, you might need to add another layer. Another touchpoint post challenge for your prospects to engage with you so whether that is something like a clarity call or host a webinar on a specific area or challenge that the audience is craving more information around and you can therefore display your expertise on that. Maybe it's a behind the scenes tour of how you work with your members in your course dashboard, Facebook live, Q and A, new bonuses, lots of ideas here but essentially that's right like the main point here that we really want to hit home with you ladies is that you do need to be prepared to change tact to pivot.
Anna Jonak: [00:41:44] A challenge is so special because you do give people such a valuable experience and so many touch points normally through the Facebook lives or the video or a cheatsheet but anything where you can add in new layers. Because how many touch points can it take someone to sign up or to make take an action like how many touch points in a funnel like normally? [Flori says well it can be just a few but it can be up to 12 exactly] Yeah so up to 12 touch points so sometimes it could just be that somebody needs that last thing or you know you change something in email and you're able to send them a little video of like what your in-person get togethers look like and you know you're not having to do much. It's just going into an email but it's another touchpoint, another experience for them, another thing. So yeah definitely learn to fly by the seat of your pants basically. So alongside kind of like an email sequence which is really crucial along with being able to add new touch points I mean there's a whole strategy that goes into sales sequence and email sequence which we can't really go into right now because that in itself is a whole other kettle of fish. But alongside that you probably be running some re-targeted ads as well. So during open cart period you would be kind of running a series of like you know driving the call to action. So people who did engage in the challenge or signed up, you'd be following them around Facebook and reminding them to take action and you might be showcasing any bonus or testimonial or so on and so forth. But you know you just want to stay on top of mind for that like one-week period normally that you've got open cart so that people cannot forget you.
Flori Pyke: [00:43:05] Totally stalk them around. Yeah definitely. And then on your website you know just be conscious of changing up your calls to action, on your home page and course page to say that you know registrations are now open or extending or offering whatever that might be. And on socials you know, you might think about welcoming your new members, personally tagging them, doing Insta lives or you know Insta stories, generate that excitement, pop some testimonials in there. Yeah lots of opportunities here to really drive the sell across different touch points. So that's kind of the during challenge phase and then you want to move to phase three. So once the challenge is finished and you need to think about wrapping things up the right way and I think this is a really important thing to shine some light on is that just because your challenge is finished doesn't mean that the work is done. And look it's not going to be a lot of work but one key thing that I want you guys to think about here. Aside from the obvious logistics of you know removing the videos from the Facebook group, deactivating your opt in page and redirecting them, archiving your group, is really analysing the data and metrics of the challenge itself. So you know what were the e-mail open rates? Which subject lines performed the best. What about the e-mail open times? Did those work? Video watches, how many people watched the video? So for instance we use Vimeo and it gives us great stats around how many people watch, click, how long, etc. for and ultimately one of the biggest metrics in addition to many that we track I must be honest with you. But if there's one that you're going to track it's your return on investment. So if you've put money behind your challenge, you need to figure out how much money you've made from the challenge and what that return on investment looks like. OK. So that's a huge one you don't want to miss out on.
Anna Jonak: [00:44:55] Yeah. Flori always like sends me this massive document at the end that we have to like, needs all information for which is such a punish. [Flori laughs] But anyway I know it's so important, but it is. It's so good to track like to have that data because we've done so many now to see what works and what doesn't. And you know as we've changed audience and price point and so on and so forth so it's so worth tracking all of that information because also, I think when you get to stages the bigger you get if you ever want to outsource any of this stuff you want fantastic data to share with people. One thing I did want to say about wrapping up the challenge I guess is just really to be mindful of saying thank you and that you appreciate that not everybody, right now is the right time like some people just they may not have the money right now, the timing might not be quite right and you know they might need to save or so on and so forth and I think it's really just letting people know that you're here whenever the time is right and there'll always be another opportunity. And to thank them for their participation and obviously we're very grateful for being able to share in the experience and whether people join you and not for us is definitely about the transformations and the impact we're able to create in and around whatever we do from you know what if we do in terms of selling and building our business but also the fact is they're actually really wonderful experiences on top of that which is why we've done so many of them.
Flori Pyke: [00:46:08] Yeah. No I think that's such a great point to make because in addition as you were saying before around you know so much of this game is touch points. I think a lot of it too with marketing is timing. Timing is everything. And exactly like you said this might not be the right time for your prospects right now but it's not to say that the right time might not be around the corner so to take that one step further you know, think about then what are you going to do with them, right? Because just because they're out of this funnel doesn't mean that you can’t re-enter them into a different funnel down the track. All right.
Anna Jonak: [00:46:40] I was just thinking that and thinking oh that is too much information because we're like what's next de de de de de de de. [both laugh]
Flori Pyke: [00:46:49] We like to give it to you guys. It's good. Lots of gold.
Anna Jonak: [00:46:53] Yeah. There's so much gold. I'm like this episode is that nearly an hour. We've been like going on and on. But you can see the challenges are not small fry. They're a big thing. There's a lot of moving parts and we trust that this is actually going to be full of gold nuggets for you and lots of things for you to consider. There's going to be some epic show notes on this. And I think we're going to create a bit of a freebie for you as well as download which really steps out a bit of a checklist of some of the key things that you want to consider when it comes to creating a challenge like this and thinking about whether it's the right thing for your business. So and you know we'd love to chat you guys on socials about this once we release it because yeah it's definitely been a big part of our journey and we'd love to see it work for some of you. So why don't you leave the parting thought.
Flori Pyke: [00:47:38] Oh OK. Now this one's by, I don't know if I'm pronouncing this right Lao Tzu but basically it is that "The way is easy. Stay on the path." And the reason why we wanted to share this with you is that whilst it seems very logical, the fact is and this is very true is that once you start going down the challenge route, you do have to see it out. You got to back yourself and go all in because there are a lot of moving parts it is going to be challenging no pun intended but honestly it is a lot of work. But once you've done it once you know the next time it's going to get easier and so on and so forth. So just stay the path.
Anna Jonak: [00:48:16] Give it a go. Making it happen. Trust in yourself. I love it. OK. All right ladies. That's it from us and of course remember be brave in your business.
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