We ask her ALL the hard questions on what's driven her fast growth as well as what challenges she's experienced on her journey, so that YOU can get on the inside on what has worked for her.
The best part? Kayla does not hold back as we chat through everything from the specifics on her influencer marketing strategy (she even spills on her outlay and ROI!), to how she goes about creating products that her customers yearn for.
Like this episode? Head to the ratings and reviews section in Apple Podcasts and share the love.
Tune in to hear about:
- How Kayla created a thriving business with $1m dollars in sales and over 10,000 repeat customers in 18 months
- What tecniques she used to drive growth
- The ins and outs on how to use influencer marketing
- How social proof can drive sales
- Kayla's customer focused retention strategy
- Kayla’s first two businesses and how those learnings have propelled Tribe Skincare to cult status
- Kayla’s biggest challenges to date and how to avoid them yourself in your small business
About Kayla Houlihan
Connect with Kayla
Flori Pyke: [00:00:00] Welcome to Episode 39 of the Brave Business Podcast. And today you've got me, Flori at the helm and I am so pumped to be in some incredible company today with Kayla Houlihan. Now have I pronounced that correctly, Houlihan? [Kayla agrees] I love that surname. It's like so catchy.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:00:21] Oh really. It's Irish.
Flori Pyke: [00:00:24] Is it? Oh okay. Got it. Well, Kayla, I'll give you like a little intro to you before you speak further about your success because you're certainly... I was just saying before we kicked off this episode how I've seen you everywhere on Facebook, chats and whatnot, like everyone talks about you and what you've been able to create. So without further ado, Kayla is the creator of the cult skincare brand for sensitive skin called Tribe Skincare. You worked for five years, is that right, as a skin therapist. [Kayla agrees] And she saw a huge gap in the market desperately that needed filling. And essentially, using digital marketing you have turned Tribe into what is an incredibly thriving business with over one million dollars in sales and over ten thousand repeat customers in 18 months. [Kayla agrees] Holy s**t.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:01:28] I know. It really does seem crazy when I think that it was all just 18 months ago that it started.
Flori Pyke: [00:01:36] Oh my gosh. Like that is nuts. You know I'm a digital marketer and I coach our students on that, and I drive our digital marketing strategy here within the business. And I look at those numbers and like that is no mean feat. That is amazing!
Kayla Houlihan: [00:01:55] Yeah. I think something I probably haven't talked about a lot and it kind of makes a bit more sense when I do talk about it is this is actually my third business. I feel like my first two businesses, I learned so much from them and almost kind of made all my mistakes there. So with Tribe is hasn't been so much learning and trial and error. It's just been kind of go go go with the things that I know work.
Flori Pyke: [00:02:22] I understand. OK. That does explain things a little bit more but still I think it's very commendable. I mean those results are absolutely extraordinary to be honest. So tell me a little bit more around, obviously you know as a marketer, I see those results and I'm just like holy how have you done this? So, I mean can you share some insights around like what, maybe even with the other businesses that you started you know, what you've learned and how you've taken those learnings to be able to create this extraordinary business Tribe skincare in such a short period of time? Like what do you attribute, if you had to kind of say OK there's like one or two key things that have enabled me to drive this growth as quickly as I've been able to do this? What would you say they are out of interest?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:03:16] Definitely social media and few little kind of techniques I've used to fast track our growth. We've got forty three thousand followers now in the 18 months and they’re all really targeted followers. So when we look at the back end about Instagram they're all in Australia, U.S. and New Zealand, which of the three countries we ship to. We have a ninety six percent female following. And that's exactly who we're essentially selling to. So I've been really really specific about how I've grown our audience so that I know when I am posting on Instagram it's the right people that are seeing the posts every time.
Flori Pyke: [00:03:54] OK. And any insight around how you have been able to grow such a targeted audience because that in itself is, I mean first of all it's hard to get those kind of numbers in the tens of thousands in such a short space of time, let alone to be so targeted, right? So how, you mentioned you know you have a few tips there or anything that you can share with us?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:04:19] Yeah kind of exactly what I've done specifically is we've used influencers that already had an audience of what we were trying to achieve. So when we work with an influencer, they send us their insights from Instagram and we have a look at what percentage of their followers are female, what percentage in Australia, all these things. And when someone has an audience we were essentially wanting to achieve, we would be working with them on competitions and usually we open the competitions to Australia, U.S. and New Zealand only so we're not getting a whole heap of international followers. And I know it's a numbers game and people think the more followers the better, but it's like if people can't even purchase the products through the website, we don't need to be showing our products to them and Instagram is going to limit who they're showing it to, so we're better off to get it in front of the right people. [Flori agrees]. Which is essentially made the audience really responsive. That we know when we send out a post and we put a code on, we're just talking about like free organic reach with Instagram. It's reaching the right people and people going on the website and using that code straight away so that we kind of always have that free advertising kind of angle rather than always having to pay to get our post in front of people.
Flori Pyke: [00:05:37] Right. So the influencer has like a custom code that you give that particular person. Is that how it works?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:05:43] Yeah definitely. We worked with codes or even just on like when we post on our own Instagram we'll have a code. Yes I guess the influencer posts. Sorry. Going back to that I'm jumping all over the place. But basically what we'll do is pay them to host a competition and the competition will be that their followers have to follow Tribe Skincare to enter and then the followers, they like what they see on our page and continue to follow us so we can kind of build a long term relationship with them over time.
Flori Pyke: [00:06:17] Yeah. OK. Got it. And how much on average, I suppose it depends on the number of followers that that influencer has. But can you give us a bit of a range around what can you expect to pay an influencer in order to drive a competition like that to promote your products?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:06:37] Yes. So it depends on what their following is. Let's just go as a rough estimate someone with maybe half a million followers we might pay maybe four or five thousand dollars for the competition to be hosted and would expect to get kind of 10 to 15 thousand new followers from it.
Flori Pyke: [00:06:55] Right. And so you pay four to five thousand dollars, right? [Kayla agrees] And they have half a million followers. And because you give them the custom code, I'm curious what kind of return on investment is the range like what kind of money do they create from driving sales for you?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:07:15] So usually we find, this is if we haven't really explained it very well. We do some competition post with influencers and then we do separate posts with the codes so we wouldn't do it all in one post because it's a lot of messaging to get across to a customer at once. [Flori agrees] But if we're paying influencer to promote their special code usually we'll get a return on the code within sort of 24 to 48 hours. And then people will still be using that code down the track. So you can kind of see you like maybe long term you might get three or four times your return on investment. And people can only use that code for their first purchase. So you can see those customers coming back down the track months later which is still revenue we've bought in from that original post, but it's spend not coming in through the code.
Flori Pyke: [00:08:07] Yup I understand. So it's basically like then you start to harness more of a retention strategy. [Kayla agrees] Because they've come and purchased from you that first time. And like we always love to say, those are your best customers because they’re the easiest ones to get to buy from you again, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:08:23] Yeah. And it's just nice to have those long term customers that you know love your product or whatever you're doing and coming back for more.
Flori Pyke: [00:08:31] Yeah. Yeah. No. Absolutely. And so I'm just going to kind of repeat that. So basically you're outlaying about four to five thousand dollars and you know you're making based on first time sales a return from anywhere around like 15 to 20 thousand dollars or so. Is that about right? [Kayla agrees] All right cool. Wow. So that's a pretty sweet return on investment. I mean that's like a good 300 percent or so which is I mean as I crunch my numbers here as a marketer I'm like geez that's not bad.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:09:05] Yeah definitely. I think it's a really affordable way to get your brand out there.
Flori Pyke: [00:09:10] Yes. Yes. Oh gosh. I completely agree. And so let's kind of deep dive into this just a little bit further. So how do you find these influencers, exactly? Because I appreciate that you know you ask them to provide you with their insights and that's kind of like you know the screening test as to whether they're the right influencer for you in the brand. But how do you even, like what's the process to find them and engage with them? Because there's so many people out there, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:09:39] Yeah definitely. I'm lucky to have a sister who is YouTube obsessed and Instagram obsessed [both laugh] so she kind of screenshot people sends them my way, "what do you think of this person?" And then I'll get in contact with them and ask for their stats. But we also work with two agencies now. We talk to our contacts at those agencies and they know that we're looking for an Australian audience, a female following, people that are interested in beauty and makeup so they will actually just send recommendations our way now which is super handy it makes it all a bit more automised.
Flori Pyke: [00:10:18] Yeah. Gosh. Yeah I can imagine. And so actually on that note when you talk about you know using an agency and that your sister helps you out a bit, given the sheer volume of sales that you're making. Like do you have a team that you work with or what does that look like in terms of the structure of the business? I'm just very curious.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:10:39] So it's still a home business. I'm fighting hard to keep it that way. Yeah it's a bit of pressure on like as in we don't have a whole lot of space but we have like a pretty decent warehouse setup at the house and then a big storage shed out the back. There's just myself and two other girls that come in and do the packing and sending out the orders all from the house. Australia Post come to the house and pick it all up. And apart from that I'm just outsourcing things now because there's no more room really to have other people work here with us.
Flori Pyke: [00:11:14] Yes. Wow. I'm amazed. So you actually house the inventory in the house, is that right? [Kayla says Yeah. In the storage shed.] In the storage shed. Oh my God. Hooly dooley.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:11:26] We have the shed to keep all the stock and then we have like a kind ofwarehouse, quick pack station in the bedroom. So we're actually in a house all day. But it is in a completely separate room. And then that room, the door gets closed at the end of the day so that it's kind of like then I'm in the house. So I'm not always between the business and house. Trying to keep like a bit of a division between the two.
Flori Pyke: [00:11:53] Yes I can appreciate how it's important to, whilst the lines are very blurred because I know exactly what you're alluding to in terms of trying to keep that division, it is good to... Exactly. Even if it's just for mental sanity, have a door you can close to the business so to speak you know, quote unquote at the end of the day, I hear you.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:12:19] And it's not the most conventional sort of structure we've got here. But I always thought with this business because it was my third one, I really wanted it to work for me and around lifestyle and I want to be home and with my dog and I really liked the idea of working from home. So we've just kind of had to adjust and make it work so that then I can kind of have that dream still happening as well.
Flori Pyke: [00:12:42] Yeah. No I love it. I love it. And so I'm going back to the influencer piece, given you know the how quickly you were able to grow. I mean I look at these stats and I think to myself like in a given month say Kayla like how many influencers would you be using at any given point or how do you structure that in terms of campaigns and monthly plans? What does that look like?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:13:08] Yeah it's a little bit all over the place because sometimes I sort of plan it out that two influencers will be posting to the month like two major influencers and then there could be delays. Everyone says that influencer campaigns take about four times as long as you think they are going to. [Flori agrees] And especially with skin care because we have to send it to them. They want to test it for a month. Make sure it goes well with their skin before they even consider starting to promote it. [Flori agrees] So I want it to be more structured that you know there's a post every two weeks or something but it just never kind of works out that way. And it kind of it's like when it rains, it pours and all of a sudden everyone's posting and we just flat out packing and then all of a sudden we have these big lull where nobody's posting. [Flori agrees] Yeah exactly. We have a group of, they’re bigger than micro influencers that have all got about 30000 followers and they’re our affiliates. They have a permanent affiliate code that they have for Tribe. They can promote that in any way they want, whenever they want. So that's kind of happening all the time behind the scenes that they’ll be doing stories and posts with their code and that's bringing in the sales as well.
Flori Pyke: [00:14:24] Yeah. OK. That's awesome. And so in terms of going back to the metrics of this all because obviously you're relying on, well I mean it's like any marketing campaign you know whenever you're gonna spend a dollar you want to track what that dollar does for you. So my guess is and correct me if I'm wrong but you must have to really measure the impact of every single influencer because I know from working with in particular a lot of our mastermind students who have used influencers in the past, they've told me you know it really varies like there's some people who are amazing and deliver huge sales for them. But then you know someone with the same number of followers with a similar audience just don't seem to get that traction in that engagement.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:15:10] Yeah definitely. And it has so much to do with the way they actually promote it. If they're promoting a different skincare brand every day or every week, it's not going to have the same effect compared to say promoting us long term. So we definitely find the long term relationships work a lot better and it takes that risk out because we've already worked with that influencer before. We know that their audience responds well to the product. So that's why we're trying to just sort of use the same ones over and over again when we find we get a good result. They like the brand. They like working with us. And we like working with them.
Flori Pyke: [00:15:47] Yup yup. Okay. Got it. And from a marketing standpoint, so obviously the influencers are a huge part of what's enabled you to achieve these results but are there any other marketing tactics that you are using at any given point in time or is it solely relying on influencers out of interest?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:16:10] We've got a few other things we do. So we've got automated Facebook ads that are re-targeting website visitors and Instagram visitors. And they're both really really highly converting. With the same kind of ad set, we change up the ad that the actual ad set has been running for over twelve months now. So lots of really really good data off all of our customers and it converts at about sort of two dollars to two dollars fifty per sale[Flori says amazing] which is incredible. And we're finding Instagram Stories is the best response with Facebook ads and also the cheapest way to present your ad to someone because that space isn't kind of I guess a supply and demand is allowing Instagram Stories to be a bit cheaper for now.
Flori Pyke: [00:16:56] Yeah yeah definitely. OK. And is that for instance those the Facebook retargeting ads and the insta stories, is that something that's also managed by the agency or is that something that you've kind of learned to do and are driving yourself because you're obviously wearing so many hats. I'm just amazed.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:17:18] Yeah I do it all myself. But I feel like because I did it so long ago I remember at the time it was so difficult and I was listening to so many podcasts about how to set up Facebook ads and reading blog posts and it took me so long to get them so that they are converting but now I literally just don't want to touch them. It's working really nicely in the background. And you can get your Facebook ads working for you then that is really automised advertising.
Flori Pyke: [00:17:51] Yeah yeah definitely. Especially that retargeting piece, right? I mean that's money for jam and they're so hot. If you can hit them with a dynamic product display campaign where they're re-targeted with what they've looked at on your site. It's like, it's a no brainer, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:18:07] Definitely. And it gets me all the time. I go to a website I get distracted and don't end up buying something. And then when I start seeing it in my Facebook and Instagram feed, I'm straight back on the website. And they eventually get me as a customer.
Flori Pyke: [00:18:21] Yeah. No. Definitely. I totally agree. OK. Right. So you're using the influencers. You've got the retargeting ads.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:18:29] Yes. And a whole lot of what we do is social proof. So we're really focused on that. We kind of have a few different things that we do. A really really effective thing we do is the before and after program with customers. Each order has a postcard that explains that. And basically the customer tracks the results at home. They take a photo before using Tribe and then after, they let us know what products they were using and submit their photos. And then if we featured their photos, they get a seventy five dollar voucher. So we get so many submissions for that which is incredible and yeah they just like that they get to be involved with it and then we can show other people throughout Instagram and website real customers' results.
Flori Pyke: [00:19:17] Yeah. No I love it. I mean that's it, right? Like objective, testimonials, case studies and social proof will drive trust so much more than just saying it yourself, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:19:30] Definitely. And we post a lot of reviews as well but we find the actual visual of seeing the before and after is so effective. [Flori agrees] Funnily enough, the posts are like the least engaging posts that we post on Instagram and they don't kind of get the reach and the likes and comments that the other posts get but all of our new customers tell us that it was the before and after photos that got them over the line. So we know that they're really really effective even though our Instagram stats a kind of showing us the opposite.
Flori Pyke: [00:20:00] Isn't that interesting, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:20:03] Because I'm all about stats. So yeah kind of growth in that way but it's just interesting that it doesn't really reflect that with the before and after program.
Flori Pyke: [00:20:12] Yeah. That is really interesting and kind of misleading like you said because by looking at the stats you wouldn't think that those posts would perform that effectively. And yet you know you're engaging with your customers and they're telling you otherwise. So that is interesting, almost shows you like it's well worth doing the research and that follow up piece to really understand what drove customers over the line, right? [Kayla agrees] Yeah. Now you mentioned retention and that you know once you get a client, a customer buying from you that first time, their likelihood to buy from you is really high and that you tend to have many many repeat. Well, I remember reading here you have over 10000 actually repeat customers which is amazing. Do you have any kind of insights that you can share with us there around how you've managed to drive so many repeat customers? Because it's all well and good to have a cracking products and obviously skincare. I appreciate you know once the pump, the pot runs out you need more. But to some degree you also have to be in their face because I know for myself I'm definitely a bit of a sl** when it comes to skincare. I'm using one one product one day and then once that is done, I'm like oh I might go try this one. So how do you do that? How do you keep the customers coming back for more? Even though your product is great, how do you do it?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:21:37] Yeah. There's a few different ways. So, I definitely agree with you that some people like to try out lots of brands and then some people have had so much trouble with their skin that as soon as they find one product that works with them, you've got them for life. They are not interested in changing. They don't want their skin to go back to the way it was so they would just absolutely stick with you. And because skincare is a consumable product, we are always going to be having returned customers naturally. [Flori agrees] Kind of not really a technique that we use but everything that we do at Tribe is very customer focused. So we're always talking to the customers finding out what they want. All of our new product launches have come from customers requesting. They tell us exactly what they want the product to feel like, what they want to see in the product, how they want it to work for them and then we will go and create that product specifically for them. So it's very very customer focused. Very good with customer service. We respond to customers quickly. We respond to them fairly. We make sure that we're really onto that because that really does keep people coming back. And just going that extra mile, we put little packets of Skittles in the orders and if someone is up to their second or third order, we'll put a free headband in that order or just always kind of giving back to them in that way. So they're being rewarded for coming back to us.
Flori Pyke: [00:23:03] Yeah. I love it. One of the things that I particularly love out of what you just told me is how customer focused you are and how basically you are creating bespoke products that are answering the needs and wants of your customers which is a huge thing that comes hand-in-hand with doing your research which we are really really big on and I always say you know in fact we had an event with our students last weekend and we were talking about research and I said you know ladies, the answers are there out there for the taking but you got to ask the questions, right? Like you can create a thriving business according to what your target audience wants but you need to be asking the questions. You can't just make a finger in the air decision that this is what they want. So I so love that you just said that you know that every decision and every product is really driven around what the customer wants because that's exactly what we do and I guess that's like music to my ears.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:24:01] Yeah. And it makes your job so much easier. Because you're not having to kind of be guessing all the time and thinking of things yourself you can bounce ideas off your customers and you kind of know that there's already a market for that product before you actually go to launch with it.
Flori Pyke: [00:24:17] Yes. I couldn't agree more. OK. Awesome. And so I mean we've talked a lot around what's worked for you but I'd love to have a bit of an insight. Lift the lid on whether you've had any challenges over the last 18 months or any failures or important lessons that you can kind of shine the light on?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:24:40] Yeah definitely. Right back at the start, I feel like I've spoken about this so many times over and over again but it is an important message to get across. So we actually started off so we were called Lifesaver Skin Care. And went to market, had four products on the market at the time and then we got a trademark infringement notice. And we were unfortunately infringing somebody's trademark and had 48 hours to cease selling under that name. We basically had 48 hours to clear out all the stock we had to make everything 50 percent off. So every single product on the website and then completely start again. So I feel like at the time, it definitely felt like the worst thing that had ever happened. But now that I reflect on it, it was definitely the best thing that happened because we'd been on the market for three months, I kind of I guess had a bit more insight into the market and I did kind of want to change up the branding anyway. And then this completely forced me to do it.
Flori Pyke: [00:25:47] Wow. I mean better late than never. Like thank goodness it happened kind of early on in the piece like you said right before you had like tens and tens of thousands of, well you probably did but I mean it could've been worse, I guess is what I'm saying, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:26:03] Totally. And I think like what I learned from that, I'm now obsessed with IP or intellectual property. I have a folder on my computer called IP and I'm just obsessed with anything that I can save in that document and be like OK we've got this covered. We've trademarked this. We've trademark that. We've got this. We've got that. And just making sure that we do have all of our IP so that nothing like that can happen again.
Flori Pyke: [00:26:29] Absolutely. And so I guess on that note how many products do you have at the moment and are they all trademarked or how do you go about that process?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:26:37] Yes. We've got 13 products on the market now. And four minis as well. So it's growing very crazy and I always have a million things in my head at once. It's a bit hard at times and we've just had to go through the process of trademarking in New Zealand and US as well. So that has actually just been completed. So we're registered.
Flori Pyke: [00:27:01] That's awesome. That's very exciting, isn't it?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:27:03] Yeah. Definitely it's a good feeling. But yes for small businesses out there even if you are starting off really small and you kind of don't want to put the time and money into trademarking, just do it from the beginning because it's just not worth it.
Flori Pyke: [00:27:17] Yeah. No I couldn't agree more with you. I mean we're so huge on doing our due diligence and it's something that we promote very much to our students as well. It's just not worth it, isn't it? And it's so important to get this right from the outset. So I think it's such a great and valuable lesson that you're sharing with our listeners because if you can avoid it and you can exactly do this homework piece before you embark on your small business. You're going to save yourself a lot of time and energy and grief in some cases, right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:27:50] Definitely. And I think that's just. Yes. Something else I've learnt is to have all your policies and procedures in place to protect yourself. So even like your customer return policies or any kind of terms and conditions have them all on your website set out so the customer can see exactly what's happening. You can see what's happening. And then when you do come across a problem you've got your strategy already mapped out. You know exactly what to send them, what to do. So it's kind of automised then it takes the emotion out of it. [Flori agrees] Whereas I know at the start when I would kind of take returns and stuff on a case by case basis and I'm always like thinking you know what's fair? Should I do this? Should I do that? And it can become quite sort of emotional. So it’s good to have your policies and procedures in place from the beginning.
Flori Pyke: [00:28:40] Yes. Absolutely. I think to reflect on that, I couldn't agree more like we as a team are expanding a lot at the moment and we've gone through a rigorous process of setting up standard operating procedures much to your point you know just to ensure that everyone is really understanding of the rules and responsibilities. Everything is you know clear as and there's no emotion involved when it's like actually that's not the way it's done. Please refer to this procedure. So I so agree with you. It makes everyone's job a lot easier when you have those procedures in place essentially. [Kayla agrees] Now I'm just curious obviously throughout this conversation you've talked a lot around data. So you're obviously very data driven. You're across your numbers which is so imperative when it comes to building a successful business. I mean essentially if you don't have a viable business model forget it. So what were your other two businesses out of interest?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:29:48] So my first business was a skin clinic with my sister which ran for three years. So that was a huge insight into the skincare industry and literally talking to women all day everyday about their skin and their skin concerns, what's worked for them and what hasn't, different skincare ingredients like it was just 100 percent like the total inspiration behind Tribe was having the skin clinic and talking to all the women there. And then my sister and I had a business where we were manufacturing a product in China and importing it into Australia to sell to other beauty salons. So it was when the big craze came out with the peel off black head removal masks. They just, we kind of got onto it right at the start of the trend. And then it was like on Today Tonight it was a kind of negative story about it. But I remember the night that Today Tonight ran that negative story about how they were you know painful and all this stuff. Our website went completely crazy and we just like ran off our feet the next day. So that was just interesting that the negative PR actually boosted sales in a major way. [Flori says isn't that interesting?] Yeah. We were just like. It was really unexpected and all our friends are like oh isn't this essentially what you girls are selling? [both laugh] And just right now everyone wants it and we can't keep up with the demand.
Flori Pyke: [00:31:16] Wow. Well don't they say like any kind of media is good media to that point basically?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:31:20] They do. And it really was true in that case. It was surprising to see.
Flori Pyke: [00:31:26] Yeah. Right. And so you've done quite a few things with your sister but Tribe is solely you. Is that right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:31:32] Yeah. Just my own on this one.
Flori Pyke: [00:31:34] Yeah. Right. OK. Love it. And any other challenges or anything else you want to share that you think would be of value for our listeners who are small business owners?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:31:45] Yeah I think a huge challenge that I definitely have found and I know is that other business owners have said is kind of always looking at what your competition's doing. And especially if you're finding that you're getting copycats and then you kind of you know obsess over it like they've copied this Instagram caption off me and done this and that and always looking at what they're doing and it is just such a negative process that is just never going to make you feel better about your business. So now I'm just so focused on Tribe. All of my time needs to be spent on tribe and I need to have a really positive mindset around that. So just yeah completely avoiding looking at competition. You're either going to end up accidentally copying them or like it's never going to kind of be an inspiring thing. So I think you better to follow people in other industries like other e-commerce brands that are selling different products to us and we take inspiration and ideas from them so we don't end up doing stuff the same as every single other skincare brand out there.
Flori Pyke: [00:32:50] Yeah that's interesting what you're saying and I appreciate. Definitely I can see how well it's funny because I always say when you look at your competitors you have a choice. You can look at them and feel inferior and you know I'm just not good enough. And exactly it can really hamper your mindset or you can kind of look at them and see them as opportunities to gain some inspiration to model them but even do a better job and to be 10 steps ahead of the Joneses what I like to say. So it's funny. Like I can completely appreciate where you're coming from and I've heard this kind of argument a lot before. You know I spend too much time looking at my competitors and then I don't progress but I think it's so important like at Business School for Mums we do really harness the importance of looking at your competitors just to understand exactly like what's going on in the marketplace, how you can be different and to choose to use them as a platform to really get inspired and model but to do better you know what they're not doing and to your point I really love how you said you know I'm looking at other industries to kind of gain some inspo around you know what else I could be doing. And I think that's awesome. I also always tell our students you know think about looking beyond borders like go look at for instance what people in your industry are doing in the U.S. for instance because often I find they're kind of 10 steps ahead than we are here. And like you know you don't have to kind of keep it local but get inspired and model and make better with what others are doing in the same marketplace. So yeah that's kind of my two cents because I can definitely appreciate where you're coming from but I always think you know there's a bit of a choice that you can have here when you look at your competitors.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:34:37] Yeah and I found like the brand Sand and Sky. They were such a huge inspiration for me. And they're from Geelong as well. And I was looking at their page all the time and feeling so inspired and like this is amazing what they're doing. They're doing this. I'm going to do that and end up essentially can't do without on purposely copying everything I'm all of a sudden doing the same promotions as them and I'm just like no this isn't good. I need to do things differently and do in my own way.
Flori Pyke: [00:35:04] Yeah no definitely. I think it's important to have exactly like you said that awareness to ensure that you're not copying but instead kind of drawing that inspiration and making it your own. But yeah I think from an understanding of how you can stand out in the market I do think it's so important to know who else is out there you know and what they're doing and how you can be better. [Kayla agrees] All right. Love it. Well thank you so much for your time, Kayla. I feel like I've just like lifted the lid on your brain. [both laugh] So I apologise for the million and one questions but obviously you know, I look at the success that you've been able to achieve in such a short space of time. And to understand how you've been able to do this is you know I wanted to know everything. So I really appreciate you sharing everything with us. It's been really great chatting with you.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:36:05] Yeah it's my pleasure. Hopefully I got the points across okay and gave people some ideas.
Flori Pyke: [00:36:10] Yeah. No I think so so much food for thought. So thank you. And in terms of where you know our listeners can find out more about you and your beautiful skincare products. Can you give us some social links or your website handle URL.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:36:27] Yeah definitely. So the website is www.tribeskincare.com.au. Nice and easy. And Instagram, if you just search Tribe Skin Care, we're the first one to come up.
Flori Pyke: [00:36:40] Love it. OK. I love it. And just to be clear your products are specifically for sensitive skin, is that right?
Kayla Houlihan: [00:36:47] Yup. That's our niche market.
Flori Pyke: [00:36:50] Good to know. I love a bit of a niche. [both laugh] All right ladies and for the show notes to read more and check out a little bit more around this episode, don't forget to pop over to our site at businessschoolformums.com/podcast. And Kayla, we have a bit of a tradition over here on the Brave Business Podcast where we get our guests to share a parting thought before we leave you off the hook. So any thoughts around that based on maybe what we've discussed today or you know a bit of I don't know a quote or some podcast or book that you recommend our listeners to read, anything you want to share around parting thought.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:37:38] Yeah. I'm trying to think what quotes I kind of live by and inspire me. I always think I know it's a really cliché one but they kind of ‘do more of what you love’. Yeah I think that's relevant to life and in business that you can kind of outsource the parts that you don't love so much and do the things that you're good at. And yeah just in life do more of the things that you love.
Flori Pyke: [00:38:00] I love it. I love it. So much wisdom. [Kayla laughs] It's simple but it's so true, right? [Kayla agrees] It's true. I mean how many people don't do that? Honestly.
Kayla Houlihan: [00:38:10] And you really have to make a conscious effort to think about what you do love doing.
Flori Pyke: [00:38:14] Yeah you really do. And you really have to draw those boundaries because how many times do you catch yourself especially as a small business owner wearing all the hats. And a lot of those hats you don't particularly enjoy doing or are they high value tasks. So I think that piece of advice is brilliant. All right. Kayla thank you so much again and ladies remember, be brave in your business.
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